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I Agree with President Putin – You Don't Negotiate with Terrorists
// The Prime Minister of Spain grants an interview to Kommersant
Russian President Vladimir Putin begins a state visit to Spain tomorrow. On the eve of their negotiations, Spanish Prime Minister Jose Luis Rodriguez Zapatero answered the questions of Kommersant correspondent Mikhail Zygar.
What do you expect from your meeting with President Putin?
President Putin and I have a good relationship. We met twice last year and I came to Moscow at the end of 2004. We hope that, in the course of the current state visit, we will be able to him similar hospitality. The governments of our countries maintain close ties and all of our ties are positive, without exception. This visit is beginning at a moment when the economic situation in both of our countries is excellent and there is the possibility of giving the necessary political impulse to making new decisions. About six agreements will be signed between ministries, which will further strengthen our ties.
Besides that, the visit will be a good opportunity for President Putin and me to exchange opinions on the most pressing problems of international life, such as Iran and conditions in the Middle East and we may be able to discuss relations between Russia and the European Union or reform of the OSCE, in which Spain will be the chairman in 2007.
What are the basic perspectives for cooperation between Russia and Spain?
Considering Spain's determination to take part in European affairs, relations with Russia play a colossal role for us. The government headed by me understands that development of a genuine strategic alliance between the European Union and Russia is in the interests of both parties. We consider our bilateral relations to be simply excellent. The positions of our countries coincide on many important international issues. Today the Russian Federation is a great economic power ad the modernization being implemented by President Putin will bring notable results. As for Spain, it is eighth in the world for economic development.
Spain, whose economic growth is significantly higher then the European average, is one of the most dynamically countries on the continent in the economic plan. Spanish enterprises are energetically advancing the newest technologies abroad and can provide Russian enterprises with good opportunities for cooperation. At the present time, there are favorable conditions to give an impulse to joint economic, trade and investment projects. Last year, more than 300,000 tourists visited Spain from Russia.
How is cooperation between Moscow and Madrid developing in the area of fighting international terrorism?
In the war against terrorism and the jihad, which have stained many countries, including Spain, with blood, more energetic, coordinated and effective action is needed from the police, judicial organs and intelligence. Bilateral cooperation with Russia is a positive factor and many of our positions are very close. In addition, Russian is actively working on the UN committee to fight terrorism, the chairman of which is Spanish Ambassador Javier Ruperez. Spain takes part in sessions of the counterterrorist action group of under the aegis of the Big Eight, which Russia is chairing this year.
At the same time, we insist that a global and strategic view of the problem must be developed for victory over terrorism. It is necessary to try to understand the essence of the threat. We have to understand what conditions encourage the spread of fanaticism and support the strategy of terror. In addition, in spite of the fact that there are views that attempt to tie terrorism with one specific religion, history shows that terrorism is not peculiar to any religion or any ideology. The ideology of the jihad, which preaches confrontation between Islam and the Judeo-Christian West, has to be countered with rational, humane, democratic, positive, optimistic and forward-looking thinking.
That is why I put forward an initiative to found an alliance of civilizations based on knowledge, understanding and mutual respect. Russia is a participant n the group at a high level. I have the honor of sharing management of the work of the group with UN Secretary General Kofi Annan and Turkish Prime Minister Recep Erdogan. I am sure that we will have one more chance to discuss this issue at the meeting with President Putin.
What are the chances for negotiations between the Spanish government and the ETA? Under what conditions would the Spanish government be prepared to begin such negotiations? How do you feel about President Putin's well-known thesis that you cannot negotiate with terrorists?
I am in complete agreement with President Putin that you cannot negotiate with terrorists. The Spanish parliament has passed a resolution that talks with the ETA will be possible only when they lay down their weapons. For a long time already, there have been no human lives lost by ETA actions and there s a huge desire by the people to live peacefully, that is even the desire of many supporters of the so-called leftist movement for independence. Therefore, it is conceivable that the moment is not far away, when the necessary conditions will be there to begin the process.
What are the basic priorities of Spanish foreign policy?
The basis of our foreign policy is the strengthening of peace and world order, supporting the role of the UN, protection of human rights, strengthening international cooperation and aid for development. Europe is our priority and, logically, relations with Russia occupy an important place in our foreign policy. Our foreign policy is undoubtedly influenced by our membership in the Ibero-American community of nations and gives much attention to Spain's cooperation with our Mediterranean neighbors. In addition, my government intents to revive our relations with the countries of the Asian region and to reinforce our presence in Africa, mainly with the goal of fighting poverty, for which we have significantly increased our contribution to development cooperation. This year, it amounts to 0.35 percent of the GDP and we are participating in the UN Program to Fight Hunger.
What do you think about European integration, the perspectives for passing the European constitution, especially after its draft was rejected in referendums in France and The Netherlands?
In just the few decades of its existence, the European Union has been able to establish an enormous space of freedom, security, enlightenment and solidarity for 400 million Europeans. Our worldview has radically changed, so that, for example, the unity of values, feelings and interests that we have created makes it unthinkable for EU member states to declare war on one another, as often happened before. Thus the history of the European Union is a history of unprecedented success not only for the peoples of Europe, but for all of humanity.
For 20 years already, Spain has been making a weighty contribution to the process of Europe. The deep development of the European project is beneficial for our country and for our partners. In an open and changing world, where there is the possibility using the advantages provided by globalization, but where it is also necessary to fight the negative consequences of that phenomenon, it is essential that Europe have the political ambition and instruments so that its voice be heard. The European choice that Spain has made was reflected in the results of the referendum on the European constitution that took place on February 20, 2005. Three-fourths of Spaniards supported the draft constitution. It is appropriate to recall that the majority of members of the European Union followed our path and have already ratified the draft. It is true that, in two EU member countries, the constitution was rejected in referendums. In June of last year, the EU made a decision to take a break to study the emerging situation and evaluate the steps that should be taken. In any case, Spain is convinced that the motives for deepening integration continue to exist. Let me add to that that, within this modern Europe that is upholding its own social model, Spain is moving confidently forward thank largely to new measures taken by the current government. We have expanded the civil rights of the Spanish population, strengthened the real equality of women, acknowledged single-sex marriages and simplified the divorce procedure. We have also improved social rights in such spheres as pensions, stipends and housing conditions. To the three main pillars on which the prosperous state rests – education, healthcare and universal pension assurance, we have added a fourth: support of persons who are in a state of dependency. That improves the conditions for 1.5 million Spanish families and gives great independence to dependents and the people who care for them, who are mainly women.
How do you assess the perspectives for Russia and the EU to draw closer?
Russia is a strategic partner for the European Union and my government encourages further closeness between Russia and the EU. I think that a strategic partnership is necessary for Russia and the EU in order to grasp all the international issues of our time and effectively respond to the serious challenges that we face in the world arena. In 2007, the agreement on cooperation and partnership expires and it will have to be replaced by some good instrument that will strengthen the ties between Russia and the European Union. Spain will support the development of any agreement that will encourage further closeness between the parties.
Recently the world media have written about the disagreement between Washington and Madrid in connection with Spain's intentions of supplying arms to Venezuela. Is Spain prepared to uphold the agreement concluded with Venezuela on military and technical cooperation in spite of U.S. objections? What goals does Madrid have in implementing this operation?
Two Spanish enterprises, EADS-CASA and Navantia, signed commercial agreements with the Venezuelan Ministry of Defense for the sale of patrol boats and transport planes. Those agreements will guarantee the full employment of hundreds of people in the next few years. It is defensive equipment that has no offensive elements and it is intended mainly for the control of naval resources and to fight illegal activity such as the drug trade. There is no embargo against Venezuela and the agreement on the sale of the patrol boats and transport planes was reached at the beginning of 2005.
A present, those enterprises are looking for the best way to fulfill the contracts signed and are solving issues of a technical character that arise during the implementation of deals of this type.
What are the perspectives for the establishment of a community of Ibero-American states as suggested by Mr. Rordigues Zapatero? What is the main goal of that association?
The Ibero-American community united 22 countries and 600 million citizens closely bound by politics, economy, culture and language. The summit in Salamanca held in October 2005 gave a new impulse to implement that joint project. A general Ibero-American secretariat (SEGIB) was formed to implement current Ibero-American themes, guarantee predominant work in society and support permanent ties with organs and organizations operating in the Ibero-American territory. Our goal is to create a single space, based on democracy, social and territorial unity to guarantee development and human rights so that its voice would be heard throughout the world.
Mikhail Zygar
All the Article in Russian as of Feb. 07, 2006
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